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Charryman
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Re: Lely Astronaut
Main negative aspect is the initial cost, IMO. Once the cows are trained, they are a great way of getting milk out of cows. We put them in because we were headed toward a 10,000kg average and wanted the cows to be milked 3x a day, mostly to relieve udder pressure & make them last longer. It's a job to get a daytime relief milker and couldn't see much hope of getting a night milker, a problem that can only get worse in time.
To that end, they have worked well with the robot cows currently averaging 3.2 milkings per day.
Main problem AFAIC, is that I personally am tied to the robots. Yes, I can disappear for a day, but someone that knows the system has to be available. That person has to have different skills to someone that just puts clusters on cows.... a mechanically minded stockman if you like, which can be hard to find.
Our maintenance costs are far higher than in the milking parlour. The reason being that we hardly ever spend a penny on the parlour and I can mend/bodge most parts of it myself. The robots HAVE to work, so are kept up together better, so far!
As to the cows, they are quieter and generally more content (as they are in every robotic herd I have visited). Mastitis and scc have remained much the same (not reduced as the salesmen say). Yields are up (especially heifers) & udders are tighter. They do not however work very well for old, lame or sick cows, as the cows will not bother to get up to be milked when their appetite is reduced. Perhaps those sorts shouldn't be around anyway? But we all have them.
Not sure how successful they would be on a grazing system? I am convinced that the cows visit the robots for food, rather than to be milked. At grass there would be less visits and lower output, I would suggest that a high fixed costs system needs to maximise it's output.
Repairs & engineer callouts haven't really been a problem. We will have been up and running for 2 years in November, including over a year of training 300 cows/heifers as they calved (prolonged as we only have 2 robots). I can count the number of callouts, other than routine maintenance visits, on one hand. I have managed to fix nearly everything else either by myself or with a telephone call to an engineer. Two of the callouts we did have, were purely to bring a small part that I didn't have in stock.
Night time phone calls are fairly infrequent, once through the initial training period. I was called out for a split milk tube last night (the usual reason and a 10 minute job, but usually at 3am  ), but that is the first time for 2 months. Having posted that, I will of course, get a call tonight! 
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Anyone wants a good Charollais ram try www.lowerye.com
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22/9/2008, 18:21
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bauldy
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Re: Lely Astronaut
Charryman ,that,s a good honest summary of your experience of robots. Some good things ,some bad!
Some people would have you believe that robots are perfect !
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23/9/2008, 6:51
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FiringOnAllFour
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Re: Lely Astronaut
Hello. Cyborg here. 
I couldn't disagree with anything Charryman said. We've been milking with them 5.5 years now.
Costs are certainly higher than we had with our old alfa parlour, for the same reasons as charryman put. To cover those, you need production. Thats why the biggest problem in my opinion is grazing. You will have to consider keeping them in for most of the time and grazing a few hours during the day so that none of them get very far off track. We grazed this summer for a few hours which I was very happy with. All cows had to pass throught the robots and be milked before leaving the building. That buys you time. I wouldn't, however, depend on them all coming back in on their own again. The first round of grazing is the hardest when the grass is clean and sweet and its a novelty. After that, they move a bit better. The whole point of them is that you dont have to waste time on the system - it should be self-perpetuating. Feeding cows into it is a no-no. I talk about grazing because it is phsycologically very important to the Ulster farmer and its a question farmers always ask.
Delaval are good, considering the horrendous task it must have been to design a machine to attach things to cows tits. But they aren't as good as lely. They'll get there some day, and I hope they will - lely need the competition.
As for being tied, that is very true. But to be honest, you can talk anyone (who can handle a spanner) over the phone how to diagnose and fix a problem. And the engineer is always a phonecall away.
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23/9/2008, 8:42
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will maxwell
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Re: Lely Astronaut
So, IF we decided to go for a robot, our cows would go from 2X a day to an average of 3.5X or so. Presumably then we'd see a slight increase in production? If so, would it be safe to say that the increased costs of maintainance would be offset by the extra income earned, combined with not having to pay an extra/relief milker?
The DeLaval unit looks good, and it comes from a company with a good track record in dairying, however Lely have the experience in robotics, and the network set-up. No doubt a bit of healthy competition would be good though!
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Farming is the oldest JOB in the world, too many people seem to have it confused with the oldest PROFESSION!
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23/9/2008, 12:08
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Charryman
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Re: Lely Astronaut
Our average of 3.2 milkings per day is based on only having the high yielders on the system and not grazing. Grazing will reduce numbers of visits and stale milkers will go in less often.
Probably FOAF's number of visits would be a better guide (with all cows milked on robots).
Our yield improved by 10-15% (as with 3x milking systems) in the first year. It dropped back a bit last winter, but then the silage was horrendous (M+2!). It is back up again now, in line with last year.
Whether the extra milk covers the extra maintenance costs and is worth the labour savings, will depend on what labour costs you (& is likely to cost you in the future) and what you think the extra margin on that additional milk is (will it be at 28ppl or 16ppl?). I'm sure someone could juggle figures to make it stack up, or not, depending on what they were selling. 
FOAF, interesting idea on the grazing. Thought about doing much the same myself this summer, what with it being such glorious weather & all). I was thinking it would increase overall intakes by giving a bit more variety in the ration, and reduce costs a bit. In a couple of hours they probably eat half what they would in a full day anyway. Do the cows come back in after a couple of hours, or do you spend much time chasing them back in?
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Anyone wants a good Charollais ram try www.lowerye.com
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23/9/2008, 13:13
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FiringOnAllFour
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Re: Lely Astronaut
Visits of 2.6-2.8 average for all cows in an all year calving herd wouldn't be far away. You will get better visitation the less quality you feed at the feed rail (i.e. no mixed ration). It slows them down, but cheapens the feed - a trade off, and a hard balance to find in my experience.
Basically, it took say four or five hours for all the cows to work their way through the machines and out the field. Then the house was empty, at which point you bring them all back in depending on how loaded the system is, and they fall straight back into routine. At subsequent grazing rotations and poorer weather, cows gradually began to return to the shed in search of something better. I just kept an eye on the list and brought them all back when things were slipping out of sync.
I'm not saying total grazing can't be done, but its not for me.
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23/9/2008, 18:30
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supersub
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Re: Lely Astronaut
quote:
MarkDay wrote:
How do De laval robots compare?I understand they are to be marketed in the UK now.
Any thoughts on Fullwood`s robots ?
I know they bought an earlier version of Lely`s and developed it from there.
Seems to be a number working in Cumbria
SS
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24/9/2008, 12:55
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markavalley
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…
so wats your somatic cell then in your barn with the robot...
like u guys talk a lot but not giving not a lot off honest detail.
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17/6/2009, 0:49
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top deck
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Re: Lely Astronaut
On the subject of recording, how are cows on a robot milk recorded?
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17/6/2009, 16:14
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Charryman
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Re: Lely Astronaut
quote:
top deck wrote:
On the subject of recording, how are cows on a robot milk recorded?
As nobody else has replied, I will.
We use a device called a Shuttle. It is a little box that connects to the robot with a compressed air line and a milk pipe from the bottom of the jar, via a pneumatic pinch clamp.You put a rack of standard sample pots in the bottom of the Shuttle and set the robot up to sample, then it drops a sample from each cow into each individual pot, moving along by means of a ratchet mechanism.
When each cow is milked and released, air is bled into the bottom of the jar to agitate the milk, then 3/4 of the milk is pumped away to the tank. Then the pinch clamp is opened for a set time so that milk drains into the sampler, then the clamp closes and the rest of the milk is pumped to the milk tank. All this happens while the next cow is being prepared for milking.
The yields are taken from the robot computer, either manually or via computer link.
It's quite a clever little device (& costs about £1,800) which is difficult to explain, so sorry if I haven't managed it particularly well. As our cows have access to both robots at any time, we need to have two Shuttles. If they can only get to one robot, then you can have one Shuttle and do each robot herd/group (if you have several) on consecutive days.
There you go. Clear as mud.
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Anyone wants a good Charollais ram try www.lowerye.com
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26/6/2009, 19:42
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top deck
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Re: Lely Astronaut
Thanks for that Charryman.
Next question: Presumably each robot has an electric motor driving a vaccuum pump 24 hours a day, does this not cause a lot of wear and tear?
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27/6/2009, 23:00
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Flintman
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Re: Lely Astronaut
What is done with the cows with hind teats that cross (besides culling or selling to others)? Surgery?
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21/8/2009, 3:35
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FiringOnAllFour
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Re: Lely Astronaut
I think you know the answer already friend.
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21/8/2009, 9:04
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Smurf4
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Lely Astronaut
How much of a beating can these machines take? I hate to think what a few of my cows could do to the arm!
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21/8/2009, 13:56
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Flintman
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Re: Lely Astronaut
If surgery is an option how is it done?
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21/8/2009, 19:56
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FiringOnAllFour
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Re: Lely Astronaut
I'll second that. You can almost forget which cows are nutcases when they are settled in the milking routine. Its only when you put them dry to pasture, and then try to round them up that you are reminded which the sharp ones are. I'm talking here about luring them out onto the road with a bag of meal to load them onto the trailer positioned against the roadside hedge.
We haven't had any damage done other than cut tubes in six and a half years. To be fair, we had plenty of those in the first year, even second and third. Then time goes by and you stop noticing things like that until one day, you get one, and realise that its been five months since you last had a cut milk tube.
The thing to realise about the construction of the arm is that it is made almost entirely out of stainless steel. Furthermore, all the crucial working parts are covered by a tough stainless lid. I've seen them jump up and down on this with their full weight. The other vital thing is that the arm is moved by pneumatic rams. Therefore, the cushioning effect of the compressed air allows the arm to give on impact. This also means that there are no gears, belts, chain and pulleys which can be broken, stretched or bent. The main lift ram just gives when a cow stands on it, and returns the arm to its correct position as soon as the cow puts her foot down.
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21/8/2009, 20:03
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