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Buze77
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I have in mind to go to this sale since it is about an hoour and half ride for me. Not sure if I will get anything but I figured it should be a fun sale to go to. Heard prices could reach $100,000. Not sure if that is true but either way should be interesting to watch. Just paging through the sale book the other night to see what will all be there. A lot of animals from the Roxy cow family that should make solid foundations in most herds. I think 160 lots with some of those being consigned from other herds. Its Mothers day weekend so maybe I'll pick something up for my mom instead of the usual vase of flowers. Besides nothing says "I love you" like potential 7 generation EX heifer.
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4/5/2008, 11:22
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JonnykelsoII
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Re: …
Haha nothing costs like it either! Im afraid If i remember in time its a case of Gas Station flowers and card..oops
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4/5/2008, 13:32
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JeffNYRC
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Re: …
100k? That sounds like spin to me. But who knows.. I looked through the catalog as well, and if any animals bring high $$$ it will be ridgedale's. Liddleholme is known to a point, was asking someone who has been all over the country at sales, and if I mentioned his name, im sure some would recognize it on here. He hasn't heard of them. So more or less, some of the high sellers will be because Barclay, and Ronnie Thomas will be there, especially Barclay (animals to canada).
Should be an interesting sale, and yes many roxys. However, if I were to buy into the roxy lines, id invest in a well known herd, where the marketing potential is MUCH greater..
Jeff
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5/5/2008, 0:26
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foxleigh
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Liddleholme Sale
wish i had known of this herd prior to their dispersal....
from their connection ad sounds like they had a lot of bloodlines that wouldve interested me.
I have to disagree with you Jeff on your last statement.... we have been able to afford to buy into bloodlines that we otherwise couldnt have by finding the little known herds that had purchased a member at a sale somewhere.
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5/5/2008, 4:53
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Buze77
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Liddleholme Sale
I would like to hope your wrong too Jeff. By saying little know herds are not very marketable you may be shooting yourself in the foot. If you go by that logic, not many people would be interested in the progeny you get from the Advent you just spent $25,000 because they have never heard of your prefix. Good cows and good pedigree sell regardless of prefix.
I think my the Allen due to Goldwyn ffrom the Roxys could be a sale topper. She might not be the typiest animal there but I am sure that kind of pedigree will demand a lot of interest from index and type breeders worldwide.
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5/5/2008, 11:29
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flyhigher
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Liddleholme Sale
FYI,Adam is the associate judge at Madison this year as well as the judge at more county shows that I can count.For someone to say that he has traveled the country over and has never heard of Liddleholme leads me to believe he is not in touch with what is going on in our businees.I believe this will be one of the finest sales in N.Y. this year.
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5/5/2008, 12:55
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Buze77
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Liddleholme Sale
I mistyped on the pedigree of the Allen daughter bred to Goldwyn. She was not from the Roxy's but related to Oman Shutter that sold for $77,000 last fall at the Bonanza. I still think she will bring a good price. I have my eye on a few that I am hoping might drop into my price range.
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5/5/2008, 15:48
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JeffNYRC
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
Tom,
The person I refer to is well known, and knows his animals...
To restate the marketability. Yes there are quality animals at the sale, backed by deep pedigrees, and some of these smaller herds that aren't known as well have sleepers.
Personally, I dont expect to do super with that heifer buze, marketing wise (initially), as I am not known (getting there). However selling something back through the same sale would yield better results, and if it was a calf she carried and red (depending if I used Talent or not), would yield good results.
But this upcoming sale, while are backed by good pedigrees, lack the quality I seek.
A couple reasons why I wont be buying there is because it is very hard to top something from a 6x all american that has competed at the big shows and won, then that dam backed by Queen of The breed 2, and a 3X all canadian 3 or 4X all american Krull Broker Elegance, and is cut like her dam. Reason 2, from here on out, the animals I seek/buy are going to be from out of the area. From PA on south and west to the midwest. Afterall I did bid on A Goldwyn out of Alicia (1st choice).. Would have been nice to add a BKB Goldwyn Name here, to the herd..
Tough to say who will top the sale. That advent (lot 1) will probably be around 15k. A red advent from ridgedale that sold out at the red futures sale, went for 15+..The roxy Shottle should be interesting, and IMO would be a nice one to pickup, considering Shottle is #1, and many are doing quite well..
Weather looks good too, dry and 65ish..
Jeff
Last edited by JeffNYRC, 5/5/2008, 17:43
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5/5/2008, 16:48
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classcow
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
Jeff, Why not buy anything local? Isn't that limiting your options? Seems odd to decide to not buy from a certain area.
Wasn't Roxy the Queen of the Breed II?
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5/5/2008, 23:55
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foxleigh
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Liddleholme Sale
I can verify that just because an animal comes from a multiple gen ex or all american dam doesnt mean the progeny will finish up EX and also just because an animal comes from the above familys and also has ex full sisters doesnt mean the one you get will turn out either.
what's wrong with the area around you anyway?
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6/5/2008, 1:00
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Buze77
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Liddleholme Sale
Maybe Jeffs got money to burn. heck if a sale like that was held a few minutes down the road from me i would be trying to save as much $ as I could and save on cattle trucking costs. Ride my bike to the sale with a few halters in the basket. Lead them home and save some gas. But then again I am surely not as distinguished breeder as Jeff seems to have become since being a part owner in a $25,000 Advent. All of a sudden pedigrees including 3 generations of 95pt dams and cow familys like Roxy and LuLu "lack the quality he seeks" Hopefully his euphoria wears of soon otherwise he might have trouble getting his head to fit underneath the sales tent.
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6/5/2008, 3:22
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triday1
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Liddleholme Sale
interesting comments, not really sure I follow. I thought roxy and example had bred on pretty well for a lot of different folks, as opposed to other cow families that only produces results at the home of the breeders in spite of hundreds of animals being sold out of their herds in the last five years or so for 5 figure prices.
Last edited by triday1, 6/5/2008, 3:47
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6/5/2008, 3:43
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JeffNYRC
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
foxleigh wrote:
I can verify that just because an animal comes from a multiple gen ex or all american dam doesnt mean the progeny will finish up EX and also just because an animal comes from the above familys and also has ex full sisters doesnt mean the one you get will turn out either.
what's wrong with the area around you anyway?
Nothing wrong with the area, however strictly buying local limits you. I know what is local, and I much rather buy outside of the region. I bought a couple locally last year, and my herd started locally. The two I bought are good cows, however now I rather buy from other areas.
I was mistaken about the Queen of the breed. Elegance was voted Queen of the breed at WDE..
and just because ANY heifer is backed by a good family, doesn't mean it will turn out as good as the family. The same can be said for ANY animal out there. Just because its backed by Roxy, Tobi, Lulu, Murphy, Alicia, Tamara, Ashlyn, or any other family, doesn't mean it will turn out as good as their counterparts.. Its what makes the breeding game interesting. Because if we all bought into good familys, and all had Ex cows from those familys, it would get boring, and the market would saturate..
As far as ego, as others have done, made the mistake of judging me based on text. Just because I bought that heifer, doesn't change a thing. I bought into the family, and will she turn out as good as the family? Who knows.. But many out of good familys, have had "duds" that never make Ex, and stay VG. But some of those duds are still highly marketable. Afterall, a heifer sold at the MM sale out of a VG dam for 28,500, and there are many more examples out there. If backed by a good family, its easier to market. Its why I invested in her..
Jeff
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6/5/2008, 12:56
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howie32
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
JeffNYRC wrote:
Nothing wrong with the area, however strictly buying local limits you.
Jeff
Couldn't you potentially be limited by only buying outside of your area? I always figure a good animal is good whether she is next door or half way across the country.
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6/5/2008, 14:25
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Big Bird
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
JeffNYRC wrote:
quote:
foxleigh wrote:
Who knows.. But many out of good familys, have had "duds" that never make Ex, and stay VG. But some of those duds are still highly marketable. Afterall, a heifer sold at the MM sale out of a VG dam for 28,500, and there are many more examples out there. If backed by a good family, its easier to market. Its why I invested in her..
Jeff
I think that's the first time I've heard a VG cow called a dud.
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6/5/2008, 15:59
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JeffNYRC
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
howie32 wrote:
quote:
JeffNYRC wrote:
Nothing wrong with the area, however strictly buying local limits you.
Jeff
Couldn't you potentially be limited by only buying outside of your area? I always figure a good animal is good whether she is next door or half way across the country.
Dont get me wrong, there are good animals around where one may live. I bought a red advent heifer down at a local sale, she is from a local farm. She went out to Carousel this spring, placed 1st&BU in her class JR 2yr old there. Marketing, wouldn't be as strong with her. Nice cow, and will get better with age..
Big Bird,
A VG when backed by 5-6-7 gens of excellent, and never goes higher. Does reset the streak. Just think if the cow went EX, and say she was from 5 gens of excellent. The marketing potential increases if she makes it 6 generations.. Thats what I mean by "dud".
Jeff
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6/5/2008, 21:06
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classcow
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
JeffNYRC wrote:
quote:
foxleigh
I was mistaken about the Queen of the breed. Elegance was voted Queen of the breed at WDE..
Jeff
Correct me if I am wrong, but the only thing I remember from WDE was the All-Time Champion in which Charity deservedly won. I do not remember a seperate Queen of the Breed contest won by Elegance.
Jeff, Your logic cotinues to slay me. Still cannot comprehend why you won;t buy locally, but to each his own.
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11/5/2008, 0:26
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howie32
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
Wow, sounds like this was a pretty good sale considering how unknown this herd is. Grossed over $1,000,000. Not sure exactly what the average was, but must have been well over $6,000. Had a few bids (New York isn't local for us), but didn't even come close on any of them. Looks like the Roxy's continue to do well for people. Has there ever been a cow family that has done so well for so many different people?
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11/5/2008, 1:16
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Buze77
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Liddleholme Sale
It was a pretty good sale. One of the nicest groups of cows form one owner in one place for sale at one time I have ever seen. It was really great to be a part of and watch some great individuals sell. The top 2 animals were lots #1 and #2. A Advent from Miss Ridgdale Rhonda brought $45,000 and a Shottle from Rhonda brought $54,500. I think the Shottle went to Missouri. Must be that buyer didn't like buying cows close to his home either.  Like you said Howie anything out of the Roxys was on fire. But so were a lot of animals tracing back to Ridgdale Fond Example and the Twinkie cow. I was able to come home with one animal. She was lot #43, Hanover-Hill Stormatic Lue. She was a yearling stormatic heifer out of 5 generations EX going back to EX96 Tora Triple Threat Lulu RC. She may not have been the fanciest individual their but I I wanted a quality cow with a top notch pedigree to work from and I think this heifer will do just that. Even if she only becomes a VG"dud" I will be pleased. I am sure i will be looking for service sire advice and opinions for this heifer in a few months......Overall it was a great experience and a fun day to be around such astute cow breeders.
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11/5/2008, 4:00
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foxleigh
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Liddleholme Sale
I was intersted in the twinkies and the descendants of dreamstrreet renae ....if anyone wants to send their catalogue myway Id be happy
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11/5/2008, 4:22
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Buze77
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Liddleholme Sale
They sold the Durham daughters from Dreamstreat Renee at the same time with the high bidder having choice or the optin to take the pair at the same price. The bidding stopped at $5000 and the buyer taking deciding to take both at that price each. At the time it seemed like a lot for 2 month old calves but considoring they were Durhams x 12 ex generations. May not have been too bad.
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11/5/2008, 10:46
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JeffNYRC
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
Lot 2 went to Kugler and Co, aka as flyhigher on here (which is in this area). Lot 1 went to Arkansas, lot 3 which IMO was a good buy and a cleaner cut animal between the 3 went for 18 or so. I left at 4:00pm, and there was still a ton of lots left. I remember Adam's father inlaw who picks up the garabage here saying that he figured an average of 3000, this was back in the winter. I figured an average of 4500 or so. Someone I know, whom I saw in the barn said he figured 6000-6500.
I'm not at all surprised, considering the way things are going this year. You had the butlerview sale grossing 2.3million or so, the march madness sale and greenlea combined grossing over 1 million, the NY spring sale grossing over 700k. I'm not sure what the regancrest sale grossed, I do know the average was 16,500+.
What helped this sale were the familys, and as the sale proved, good cow familys do matter. Will the calves from these familys bring as much? Tough to say, would depend where they are marketed. But the one heifer that interested me, was the fortune daughter out of the 3 gens of 3E 95pt cows. I was looking for a "steal" with her. After seeing her legs up close, what she went for id never pay (didn't have the greatest of legs). Great frame/rump/depth, but those legs could give the buyer problems later on.
What I was happy to hear was what lot 64 or 63 brought, forget which one brought 30k+. I have a maternal sister to those lots, an affirmed out of magnolia. So what I paid for her, was a good price..
Also that advent from Rhonda. Took a good hard look at her, and after seeing what she went for, what I paid for the advent I bought out of electra, I paid less than what she should have gone for. Quite a difference between those two, the roxy broke some at her loin (where she was standing), legs are nice, but not as clean.. Head and neck aren't as dairy/clean, along with the length, not as long.
But again, the difference between all american breeding/familys..
Good sale, interested to see how things panout for him, as he is going to rebuild a new herd in a couple years. Rhonda is still somewhere (if not at the sale, at ridgedale), he has bought a few at some sales, and a 1st choice at the NY ET sale. So they are the beginnings of his new herd.
Jeff
Last edited by JeffNYRC, 11/5/2008, 23:10
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11/5/2008, 23:08
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howie32
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
JeffNYRC wrote:
Also that advent from Rhonda. Took a good hard look at her, and after seeing what she went for, what I paid for the advent I bought out of electra, I paid less than what she should have gone for. Quite a difference between those two, the roxy broke some at her loin (where she was standing), legs are nice, but not as clean.. Head and neck aren't as dairy/clean, along with the length, not as long.
Jeff
Congrats on your steal.
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12/5/2008, 14:16
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triday1
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Liddleholme Sale
jeff,
before I write a diatribe was your post above howie's
"Also that advent from Rhonda. Took a good hard look at her, and after seeing what she went for, what I paid for the advent I bought out of electra, I paid less than what she should have gone for. Quite a difference between those two, the roxy broke some at her loin (where she was standing), legs are nice, but not as clean.. Head and neck aren't as dairy/clean, along with the length, not as long.
But again, the difference between all american breeding/familys.. "
were you implying that elegance clan was a superior breeding family to the roxy clan?
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12/5/2008, 16:33
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Jeash
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
Am I correct that the only All-Americans to come out of Elegance have been owned by Budjon/Kietzman? How does that happen with all the cattle and embryos that they have sold? Do they hold the good ones back?
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12/5/2008, 18:32
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JeffNYRC
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
triday1 wrote:
jeff,
before I write a diatribe was your post above howie's
"Also that advent from Rhonda. Took a good hard look at her, and after seeing what she went for, what I paid for the advent I bought out of electra, I paid less than what she should have gone for. Quite a difference between those two, the roxy broke some at her loin (where she was standing), legs are nice, but not as clean.. Head and neck aren't as dairy/clean, along with the length, not as long.
But again, the difference between all american breeding/familys.. "
were you implying that elegance clan was a superior breeding family to the roxy clan?
No.. Comparing heifers..
Jeff
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12/5/2008, 18:33
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foxleigh
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Re: Liddleholme Sale
quote:
Jeash wrote:
Am I correct that the only All-Americans to come out of Elegance have been owned by Budjon/Kietzman? How does that happen with all the cattle and embryos that they have sold? Do they hold the good ones back?
1)doesnt everyone keep the best one for themselves?
2)have had 2 on farm visits during various trips and they are very big on paying attention to detail - it's the little things that make the difference every day of the year
3) there have been daus of elegance sold that are doing a fine job of breeeding on
4) Triday.... the roxys have had a better strike rate here in terms of how well sons have done compared to elegance sons.so despite contemplating purchase of "elegance" embryos wouldnt necessarily go and use anymore sons from that family
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12/5/2008, 21:45
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Buze77
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Liddleholme Sale
Jeff, if you are still wondering were the 100k figure came from you should have just asked earlier. I called Merry Rama up for a sale book and Dave mentioned how there "could be" some animals reach $100,000. So when I saw a thread about the sale I couldn't resist but adding my 2 cents from what I had "heard". But like you said could all have been spin by the sales staff to get folks excited about the sale. My dad is good friends with the Rama's so I don't think they were trying to bamboozle anyone, just trying to create some buzz. And apperantly it worked for me. Sorry if I misrepresented who the high selling lot #2 was sold to. Like I wrote.."I think she went to Missouri" I wasn't trying to trick anyone. Just trying to go one from what I recalled from the sale. I probably mistook her new home for lot #1 or another high seller. The first information is not always the best information. Maybe the syndicate from Missouri I mentioned was the contending bidder or they may have gotten lot #1. I guess if people are dying to know the new homes for the cattle they can check the sales website. I figue the only one I need to know were she went to was the one I bought.
Like i said before it waw very nice to be apart of a great group of cattle on a sale day. Cattle not consigned but bred by one farmer who new what he wanted and stuck with it. Being apart of something like that makes you want to be a better breeder so some day when you are able to sell out or consign you can be proud of all your hard work. I thought Lot #5 was a good buy. A yearling Aspen x EX james x Rhonda. for $9700 you had a yearing to get your Roxy branch started from a wicked nice dam who sold for $40,000. I also agree with Jeff that lot 63 was a good buy for $10,200. A 87pt Sky-Fame from Murphy due in June to stormatic. Her Durham sister brought $32,000. The nice thing about buying a cow was they already scored and ready to milk. A lot can happen to a calf or a yearling hiefer before she is calved out and scored.
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13/5/2008, 1:56
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