Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public ~ at Runboard.com

Username: Password:
Local User? Lost Password
Register Home Contact Control Panel Logout



COWTALK
 Main chat
  Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public
Support
Search

runboard.com       Register for a free global account (learn about it) |
Log in: (), globally (lost password?)

Poll results (voting closed)
Yes
22 votes
 
 55%
No
4 votes
 
 10%
No but if not then it should be subject to vigorous testing
14 votes
 
 35%
Total: 40 voters.  Total votes: 40.  Max items per vote allowed: 1.
 
Will Richardson
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: Close to a pub
Posts: 1275
Karma: 14 (+14/-0)
 | 
Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


 

 You have to be a member to vote


8/6/2008, 17:46   
 
bauldy
VG85
Global user

Registered: 01-2008
Posts: 68
Karma: 1 (+1/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


In the UK the vast majority of the liquid milk is pasteurised and homogenised,( i.e the milk is separated and then reconstituted to 1%,2%,4% fat etc,).Some forward thinking producers have stopped separating there full fat milk and they sell a pasteurised product which changes fat and solids content with the seasons and with changes to feeding. Milk from summer grass tastes different to milk from cows on the winter ration. It may be a niche market but differentiation has to be a bit of a marketing advantage.
9/6/2008, 6:14   
 
Will Richardson
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: Close to a pub
Posts: 1275
Karma: 14 (+14/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public



 Voting to close soon all those who want to vote hurry up and do so please.


16/6/2008, 18:45   
 
JeffNYRC
EX95
Global user

Registered: 09-2005
Posts: 610
Karma: 4 (+4/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


I had to vote three.. Something for all to ponder. How come you can buy raw meat, raw vegitables, raw fish, and some other raw products, and that is ok. They do not force you to cook it, you could easily take it home and eat it raw (some people do). The same option could be given to milk, as any meat product can be just as dangerous as milk. Actually, I remember distinctly the HUGE recall last year out west, this is a product sold raw too (recall came 2 months late). Then recently the tomato scare, another raw product.

My point is, they allow raw products to be sold in VOLUME. Yet for some reason, raw milk is deemed as poision, yet in 30+ years FAR FAR less have been sickened (if we use their numbers (CDC)), it numbers 1000 or so. Compared to 80 million a year from controlled foods.

Jeff

---
"You can't lose if you don't expect to win." - My show philosophy.
16/6/2008, 19:48   
 
Will Richardson
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: Close to a pub
Posts: 1275
Karma: 14 (+14/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public



 Thats 90% in favour of either pasteurising milk or having a stringent testing procudure for untreated milk if it is to be sold to the general public.


 
16/6/2008, 21:07   
 
Charryman
Ex96
Global user

Registered: 12-2004
Location: Glos. UK
Posts: 979
Karma: 11 (+11/-0)
Avatar
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


Or.... 45% saying it's OK to sell raw milk/55% saying it's not.

Aren't stats great? You can read them in so many ways. emoticon

---
Anyone wants a good Charollais ram try www.lowerye.com
16/6/2008, 22:22   
 
Buckeye
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 03-2005
Posts: 2573
Karma: 31 (+31/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


quote:

JeffNYRC wrote:

I had to vote three.. Something for all to ponder. How come you can buy raw meat, raw vegitables, raw fish, and some other raw products, and that is ok. They do not force you to cook it, you could easily take it home and eat it raw (some people do). The same option could be given to milk, as any meat product can be just as dangerous as milk. Actually, I remember distinctly the HUGE recall last year out west, this is a product sold raw too (recall came 2 months late). Then recently the tomato scare, another raw product.

My point is, they allow raw products to be sold in VOLUME. Yet for some reason, raw milk is deemed as poision, yet in 30+ years FAR FAR less have been sickened (if we use their numbers (CDC)), it numbers 1000 or so. Compared to 80 million a year from controlled foods.

Jeff



Two words: Shelf Life

I proposition the reason those numbers are low is because the VAST majority of milk is pasteurized.


---
Buckeye seems like a one man wrecking crew out to rid the world of injustice. ----- Mayjay
17/6/2008, 11:24   
 
mckeague
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Posts: 1310
Karma: 6 (+6/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


quote:

Or.... 45% saying it's OK to sell raw milk/55% saying it's not.

Aren't stats great? You can read them in so many ways.



Who was it that said "lies, lies and more damn statistics!"

---
Work with Cross-Border Farmer Gps. Still involved in home farm, Inishowen Holsteins & Knock Texels! Herd av. 8, 300kg (its gone up) on grass based diet, av. class. around 82 - 83 pts. Need a good Texel ram talk to me!
17/6/2008, 12:36   
 
foxleigh
Ex97
True blue dinky-di maverick

Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: southern,oz
Posts: 1956
Karma: 20 (+20/-0)
 | 
Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


re shelf life......
our milk processor company tells us that shelf life depends on 1) how cold the milk is before pickup and how quickly it is cooled from the cow.We have had to throw out milk that was taken straight from the cows because our vat wasnt working (milk and throw ....gave it to the local piggery).Over 9 degreess and they leave it behind.At 5 or 6 degrees they wait for it to drop.They really like it when the milk is 1- 2 degrees.Cell counts apparently also contribute to shelf life.
17/6/2008, 20:48   
 
JeffNYRC
EX95
Global user

Registered: 09-2005
Posts: 610
Karma: 4 (+4/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


quote:

foxleigh wrote:

re shelf life......
our milk processor company tells us that shelf life depends on 1) how cold the milk is before pickup and how quickly it is cooled from the cow.We have had to throw out milk that was taken straight from the cows because our vat wasnt working (milk and throw ....gave it to the local piggery).Over 9 degreess and they leave it behind.At 5 or 6 degrees they wait for it to drop.They really like it when the milk is 1- 2 degrees.Cell counts apparently also contribute to shelf life.



To add.. Raw milk naturally sours, and pasteurized milk rots. There has been many times when we used to buy regular milk. That milk would not keep, and we went through it in short order. There were many occasions I would pour some for a bowl of cereal, and take a bite, to be surprised with spoiled milk. So each time I would go to use it, I would check it by smelling it, to see if it was sour, and sometimes it would be.

Mind you, this is milk that is only a day or so old from a place that touts their milk as being the "freshest around". When we did sell it, we had a customer tell us she had some sitting in her fridge for 2 weeks. She went to taste it, and it tasted the same as if it was less than a day old. Any milk from the store we have had, never lasted beyond a few days. This is because (and it has been tested), the bacteria present in Raw milk does fight with other bacteria, in pasteurized milk there is 0 bacteria. So whatever gets in, can grow and grow.

Another funny thing, the local company that is still very much in buisness that sells milk, picks up milk, and other products. They were putting chemicals in the milk to kill the bacteria. Some people complained of an off flavour of the milk. Gotta love that.. Somehow that was ok, but its bad news to sell raw milk emoticon.


Also SCC does play a MAJOR role in shelf life. A cell count of 200-300k or so, the milk wont last as long. A cell count of under 100k, it will last longer.


Jeff

Last edited by JeffNYRC, 18/6/2008, 12:10


---
"You can't lose if you don't expect to win." - My show philosophy.
18/6/2008, 12:07   
 
FiringOnAllFour
Ex97
Cyborg

Global user

Registered: 01-2004
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 1600
Karma: 39 (+39/-0)
Avatar
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


For some reason, any time I go on holidays to Mediterranean Europe, I can't seem to get fresh milk, or cream. Only horrible UHT. Do they actually want people to like milk and buy it? Don't they all have fridges the same as us in the UK?




Last edited by FiringOnAllFour, 19/6/2008, 8:26
18/6/2008, 22:16   
 
dairylands
EX90
Global user

Registered: 03-2006
Posts: 171
Karma: 1 (+1/-0)
 | 
Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


The reason I was given was that the consumer didn't want to go to the supermarket often enough to get fresh pasteurised milk.
19/6/2008, 7:52   
 
smous
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 11-2003
Location: South Africa
Posts: 1552
Karma: 40 (+40/-0)
Avatar
 | 





---
WWS-SA
19/6/2008, 8:37   
 
supersub
GP82
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Posts: 29
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


quote:

foxleigh wrote:

re shelf life......
our milk processor company tells us that shelf life depends on 1) how cold the milk is before pickup and how quickly it is cooled from the cow.We have had to throw out milk that was taken straight from the cows because our vat wasnt working (milk and throw ....gave it to the local piggery).Over 9 degreess and they leave it behind.At 5 or 6 degrees they wait for it to drop.They really like it when the milk is 1- 2 degrees.Cell counts apparently also contribute to shelf life.



We bottle our own milk.
We find -
There is no difference in the taste of our milk straight from the cow and after it has been pasterurised.

We put a 10 day use by date on, samples kept in the cold store at 2 - 3 C are fine after 17 days.

The keeping quality of our milk does not change with variations in TBC or cell count.

Customers say our milk taste is far superior to s/market milk.

So what do the big boys do different to us ?

- Haul milk hundreds of miles
- Inside sources claim "use by" milk is returned to the intake tank.
19/6/2008, 15:47   
 
supersub
GP82
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Posts: 29
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


quote:

supersub wrote:

quote:

foxleigh wrote:

re shelf life......
our milk processor company tells us that shelf life depends on 1) how cold the milk is before pickup and how quickly it is cooled from the cow.We have had to throw out milk that was taken straight from the cows because our vat wasnt working (milk and throw ....gave it to the local piggery).Over 9 degreess and they leave it behind.At 5 or 6 degrees they wait for it to drop.They really like it when the milk is 1- 2 degrees.Cell counts apparently also contribute to shelf life.



We bottle our own milk.
We find -
There is no difference in the taste of our milk straight from the cow and after it has been pasterurised.

We put a 10 day use by date on, samples kept in the cold store at 2 - 3 C are fine after 17 days.

The keeping quality of our milk does not change with variations in TBC or cell count.

Customers say our milk taste is far superior to s/market milk.

So what do the big boys do different to us ?

- Haul milk hundreds of miles
- Inside sources claim "use by" milk is returned to the intake tank.



opps - that went before I`d finished

- Temp control during distribution is questionable.

SS
19/6/2008, 15:50   
 
PEOVEREYE
EX95
Global user

Registered: 02-2005
Posts: 604
Karma: 6 (+6/-0)
Avatar
 | 
Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


Supersub i guess also that you are not skimming so your fat will be 4% ? against even milk sold as whole can be 3.5% and whats skimmed 1.5% ?
19/6/2008, 23:24   
 
supersub
GP82
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Posts: 29
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
 | 
Re: Should ALL milk be pasteurised for sale to the public


Our whole is between 3.8 & 4.4
Semi is 1.5 & 1.8
Skim is less than 0.5

We don`t homoganise our milk

SS
20/6/2008, 6:16   
 


click here to give a full reply or use the box below for a quick reply






Powered by AkBBS 0.9.5b  -  Link to us   -  Blogs   -  Hall of Honour   -  Chat
Click here to get your own free message board
You are not logged in (login)      Board's time is: 23/11/2008, 10:02

Disclaimer: Any views expressed on this site are not necessarily the views of the owner or any of the sponsors of Cowtalk..

Make COWTALK Your Homepage






Google
WWW COWTALK

Site Meter