COWTALK :: Main chat :: Bull Calves ~ Runboard

Username:	Password:
Local User?	Lost Password

Home

Contact

Control Panel

Logout

COWTALK
Main chat
Bull Calves

Support
Search
RSS

runboard.com

Page: 1 2 3

foxleigh
Ex97
True blue dinky-di maverick
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: southern,oz
Posts: 2196
Karma: 21 (+21/-0)

Re: Bull Calves

moral views are welcome too!(altho I have gotton into trouble for jokes not understood, pays to think out side the square and DONT take anything personally)

14/5/2004, 22:12

moores af
VG88
Global user

Registered: 11-2007
Posts: 115
Karma: 3 (+3/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

Came across this thread last night when procrastinating from doing my work! Thought it was interesting in light of the recent Bovatel discussion.

Will, if you can remember back that far what was the outcome?

7/3/2009, 11:39

smous
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 11-2003
Location: South Africa
Posts: 1905
Karma: 40 (+40/-0)
Avatar

…

Are you interested in what he got for his kidney or if his bull: heifer ratio straightened itself out?

I had a client of fourteen years, phone me on Friday morning and inform me he was now an ex client as my bulls gave him to many bull calves in comparison to local sires. Pity, as he said he was more than happy with the cows over the years, there just weren't enough of them. I am stumped.

---
WWS-SA

7/3/2009, 14:14

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Re: …

quote:
smous wrote:

Are you interested in what he got for his kidney or if his bull: heifer ratio straightened itself out?

I had a client of fourteen years, phone me on Friday morning and inform me he was now an ex client as my bulls gave him to many bull calves in comparison to local sires. Pity, as he said he was more than happy with the cows over the years, there just weren't enough of them. I am stumped.

When you say local sires I assume that you mean AI sires, not natural service? Are we talking about a large sample size here? I know somebody who will not buy off Semex because he claims they leave him with too many bull calves.

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

7/3/2009, 15:43

Mayjay
EX95
Global user

Registered: 03-2007
Posts: 544
Karma: 6 (+6/-0)

Re: …

The lord works in mysterious ways.

7/3/2009, 17:25

smous
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 11-2003
Location: South Africa
Posts: 1905
Karma: 40 (+40/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

ER, I mean local AI sires. He milks about 250 cows and I provided about 70-80% of his semen up till about a year ago.

---
WWS-SA

7/3/2009, 20:57

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

I would just wait 12 months and see how many extra heifer calves he gets off 100% local sires emoticon

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

7/3/2009, 22:23

will maxwell
EX95
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: Markethill, Larne, Armagh?!
Posts: 616
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

This IS a blast from the past!! Thanks M AF!

So far the kidneys are both still intact, although with the 'REDUNDANCY' word being bandied about our office this weather, the thought of a get rich quick 'donation' is tempting!! (Tongue firmly in cheek!) emoticon

I have to say Newry Leo (the Lee son from Jim Stevensons herd) has probably had the biggest single impact on our herd. I can't remember exact details now, but we certainly got a good few daughters out of him, and he was only beef-burgered when he was at risk of going to work on his own daughters, he was a wee bit 'boystrous' too!

No doubt a plan was worked out by the Chief Herdsman, and the fact that He's in control certainly helps getting through the current downturn, not only in the construction industry, but also on the farm.

---
Farming is the oldest JOB in the world, too many people seem to have it confused with the oldest PROFESSION!

8/3/2009, 22:29

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Re: …

quote:
Mayjay wrote:

The lord works in mysterious ways.

I do not think he buys off Foundation either... emoticon

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

9/3/2009, 23:11

smous
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 11-2003
Location: South Africa
Posts: 1905
Karma: 40 (+40/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

Have asked all clients in same district to send me their 2008 stats, first one came in this morning: 822 calves carried to term: 395 heifers, 427 bulls = 48% heifers.

---
WWS-SA

10/3/2009, 4:24

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

quote:
smous wrote:

Have asked all clients in same district to send me their 2008 stats, first one came in this morning: 822 calves carried to term: 395 heifers, 427 bulls = 48% heifers.

How many of your clients will have used Bovitel? Will any significant number of calves be result of natural service? What was ratio in original herd? Was this an ongoing problem year on year or a one off?

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

10/3/2009, 5:15

smous
Cowtalk Staff
Global user

Registered: 11-2003
Location: South Africa
Posts: 1905
Karma: 40 (+40/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

The 822 calves client uses 100% WWS, no clean up bulls, no Bovitel.

I have sold Bovitel to only a few herds.

I have only asked clients for their bull to heifer ratio who use 100% our bulls.

Guy who is unhappy with all his bull calves has being battling with low female rate for a number of years.

---
WWS-SA

10/3/2009, 12:45

LRG
Ex97
Addict!
Global user

Registered: 08-2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 1154
Karma: 13 (+13/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

Tell your clients to try breeding their animals earlier in the heats

---
Farm's Holstein Herd: 25 milking and dry. Classification: 10VG 12GP 2G 1F.

My Holstein Herd: 1VG (by Dundee) and 2 Calves (by Fortune and Goldwyn)

10/3/2009, 13:55

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

For 20 years now we have dealt with a small consultancy firm in South Wales who specialise in diagnosing and treating trace element deficiencies in livestock (mainly through the use of pasture dressings). Rightly or wrongly they maintain that an excess of male calves is a sign of selenium deficiency. While I was watching Liverpool demolish Real Madrid on Wednesday emoticon

I went back through my calving records for the last 8 years. For what it is worth, over any 12 month period we rarely move away from 50/50.

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

15/3/2009, 14:45

Smurf4
EX94
Global user

Registered: 05-2008
Location: Cork, Ireland
Posts: 485
Karma: 3 (+3/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

Just checked, we had 52% heifers last year.

15/3/2009, 21:34

Cowman17
GP84
Global user

Registered: 02-2009
Posts: 46
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Re: Bull Calves

I, with 300 cows used to run a little under 50/50. Now however, all of my numbers are off due to sexed semen. It does seem though, that their was always a tendency for more bulls than heifers for some reason. Its odd, because from an evolutionary standpoint I would expect it to be the opposite.

22/3/2009, 15:11

CDN
GP82
Global user

Registered: 02-2009
Posts: 23
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Bull Calves

You would asume the ratio would naturally be 50/50 but somewhere I read that there are as a rule 48% heifers to 52% bulls. It's also believed that et calves give more bull

22/3/2009, 18:52

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

If I remember correctly, female embryos are more likely to suffer early embryonic death leading to the slightly higher percentage of male calves.

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

22/3/2009, 21:05

Smurf4
EX94
Global user

Registered: 05-2008
Location: Cork, Ireland
Posts: 485
Karma: 3 (+3/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

Why is that ER?

22/3/2009, 21:10

ExpectingRain
EX95
Global user

Registered: 04-2007
Location: SE Cumbria
Posts: 708
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

I do not know, may be Eryl Vet knows more about this. I just tried Googling the question and found out that the same thing appears to happen in chickens...but nothing about cows. I did how ever turn up one paper claiming that the time of insemination in cattle did not affect the percentage of male and female calves.

---
Crosshutton Holsteins

60 Homebred cows Annual Average 9800 4.2. 3.3
1EX 32VG 16GP 10G 1F 1P

22/3/2009, 21:42

CDN
GP82
Global user

Registered: 02-2009
Posts: 23
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Bull Calves

I've also heard the belief that #3 embryos though are more often heifers. Anyone else heard this one. My experience would say it's true but never know

24/3/2009, 0:52

Cowman17
GP84
Global user

Registered: 02-2009
Posts: 46
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Bull Calves

That wouldn't make any sense however. Sex of a calf is totally decided by the bull, and the idea that heifers would be more likely to have early embryonic death seems ludicris as heifers and bulls undergo the same growing proccess as embryos.

24/3/2009, 2:24

foxleigh
Ex97
True blue dinky-di maverick
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Location: southern,oz
Posts: 2196
Karma: 21 (+21/-0)

Bull Calves

ok well explain this......my husband paid 6k for a heifer for a new family.
she was called parrabel astro whynot - an astrojet.every calf she ever had was a bull.this became the standing joke in queensland.Before we sold her as a 12 year old we flushed her and every single embryo that held was a bull calf.

24/3/2009, 6:10

FiringOnAllFour
Ex97
Cyborg
Global user

Registered: 01-2004
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 1839
Karma: 41 (+41/-0)
Avatar

Re: Bull Calves

A fault on the female chromosome which didn't appear in the male DNA?

24/3/2009, 10:05

doircath
GP81
Global user

Registered: 11-2005
Location: Ireland
Posts: 15
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Re: Bull Calves

quote:
Smurf4 wrote:

Just checked, we had 52% heifers last year.

God its hard to beat the Cork boys!! 52%!!

25/3/2009, 12:06

robroy
EX90
Global user

Registered: 06-2003
Posts: 152
Karma: 3 (+3/-0)

Re: Bull Calves

at the moment I am doing fertility analysis in over 40 herds with 23 of them ranging between 250 and 650 cows,,these 23 herds averaged 46% female calves born from within the milking portion in 2008 , note this does not include the maiden heifers who averaged 47%

25/3/2009, 19:35

Dogglercowman
GP82
Global user

Registered: 03-2009
Posts: 29
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Bull Calves

HELP!!!!Can someone please explain why my dairy calvings this season have averaged an appalling 13 heifer calves and 32 bull calves?

27/3/2009, 20:30

top deck
VG85
Global user

Registered: 12-2006
Posts: 53
Karma: 1 (+1/-0)

Bull Calves

You haven`t been using sexed semen. emoticon

27/3/2009, 22:00

Smurf4
EX94
Global user

Registered: 05-2008
Location: Cork, Ireland
Posts: 485
Karma: 3 (+3/-0)
Avatar

Bull Calves

Maybe he has, but the wrong kind! Ask for female sexed next time..

27/3/2009, 22:40

Dogglercowman
GP82
Global user

Registered: 03-2009
Posts: 29
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)

Bull Calves

I have used mainly young sire semen at that from four different sires there must be a genuine reason for this? any ideas fellow cowtalkers?

27/3/2009, 23:55

click here to give a full reply or use the box below for a quick reply

Page: 1 2 3

You are not logged in (login) Board's time is: 1/12/2009, 13:30

Disclaimer: Any views expressed on this site are not necessarily the views of the owner or any of the sponsors of Cowtalk..

Make COWTALK Your Homepage

WWW COWTALK

<a href="http://www.web-i18n.net/Rb/stats.jspx">ccwf's Runboard Add-on Stats</a>