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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I recently purchased a yearling heifer that traces back to A Tora Triple Threat Lulu. Her sire stack is Stormatic x Mandel x Sheik x Triple Threat. I wanted to get into a popular cow family and work on increasing the quality of my herd and she will be one I will start working with. I was just wondering what peoples thoughts or ideas are on what sires have worked well on this family in the past and what would cross up well with Stormatic. All suggestions are welcome whether the bull be 30 years old or a new release. Some sires I have tossed around so far are...
Dundee (sexed)
Pro (sexed)
Mr. Sam (sexed)
Advent
Renaissance Triumphant
James
Durham
Thanks in advance for your input.
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13/5/2008, 22:41
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howie32
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Re: Stormatic from LuLu family
How about Damion or Aspen.
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14/5/2008, 2:06
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foxleigh
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me - I'd look for some strength something like marcrest encore.
to be honest at least half those bulls youve suggested scare me on that lineup
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14/5/2008, 6:20
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Buze77
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Thats why I am asking the opinions of more experienced breeders who have seen more results or offerings then I have so far. I would say she is a pretty dairy individual but not narrow in the front end. Excellent feet and if anything a little bit too straight in the leg. I did not see her mother but classification score was E90 VEEEV @ 4y-11m. She has a older sister by Rubens who was vg88 +EVVE @5y-7m
I put a few bulls that are available sexed down Dundee (possibly the best match) Pro (the rubens sister looked good) and Sam (high reliability on a sound proof) because I was hoping to breed her to something that would increase my chances of getting another animal to work with. But I still would like to make it the best animal possible if those three bulls were not a good match. i do have some Encore that i would considor using in a flush but I figured on a virgin heifer sexed Dundee would be solid choice as well and save the Encore for later. Thanks for the input so far.
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14/5/2008, 10:30
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JEB12
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I have seen some really fancy Damion calves that were out of Stormatic dams. I think that could be a really good cross. You might consider Shottle if you can get your hands on any semen.
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14/5/2008, 14:33
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foxleigh
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Stormatic from LuLu family
marcrest encore.....
maybe raider
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15/5/2008, 21:52
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
Foxleaigh you seem pretty convinced in Encore. Have you seen good results from this mating? or from this family in general? What are your thoughts on Linjet or even Lindy. I have used both those bulls to add substance to some of my cows. Lindys have super udders but are not quite as tall as the Linjets.
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16/5/2008, 2:33
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foxleigh
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I have 2 encores that are the result of a flush (there are 2 more sisters out here in a local herd from embryos we sold on)from a 9 gen ex cow that probably lacked front end as a young cow (she sat on VG87 until she was over 10yo)That said I loved the cow when I first saw her regardless.Triday is probably the fellow who had the most famous success with encore.I think the thing he does best is add power - width of front end without losing all the other attributes that make a cow profitible.He is not really a sire of sons as too many can be short in the neck and therefore lacking in dairy character.However I like to see a shot in a pedigree especially one like yours where you have several generations of bulls that can lack chest width in their progeny.(im a great believer that just because an animal may be ok in a trait she/he still carries that gene and one never knows where in the future it will show up again)We tried elegances encore son here and it was a disaster.Encore is not a bull that we could use directly on most of our herd rather a bull whose progeny we like to add.There are a couple of encore s around Id love to flush to durham.If you were to toss encore into the pedigree then you could add durham to next generation.(it's all about knowing where you have been and where u are going).We saw the encores at regancrest from delia - it took them a while to go EX and they were what we call "great grazing cows rather than TMR cows"Too good of a wicket and they get fat rather than milk.
We never used lindy because most out here just lacked front end as well as componants.Linjet we fell onto by accident.1997 we went to onterio to stay with old friends of mine and catch up with Doug Savage.Frank Haig took us on a whislte stop tour of his mates farms and over and over these first calvers stood out- sunnylodge linjets.We were telling Doug and he organized for us to go to sunnylodge.There were 2 full sisters to linjet there and they were like chalk and cheese.One was like all the lindys out here and the other threw to prelude and had that great width of chest,power and strength.We went home and used 20 straws and got 1 heifer who is an 87 cow that will leave the herd shortly as she is empty.She has shocking feet and legs but her dam was the weakest frailest badleggedest thing you could find.The other 2 are daughters of wilonna lite SB gay and we love them.WE still have a bit of semen but again he is like encore- love him in a pedigree harder to use here on our own cows.
hope this makes sense to you
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16/5/2008, 5:17
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
Yeah i see what your saying. I especially agree with what you said about trying to think one step ahead. Thats why I am not afraid to use a bull that is older and may not be as flashy as some newer bull. encore has worked well for me on whatever heifers I had a little trouble getting heifer calves till just lately when I got 3 in a row. I forgot how Lindys's % were low, I definately don't want to use a bull who is too minus for fat and protein % because the LuLu family has pretty high components and the Stormatic probably took a hit on that already. You've convinced me to move Encore near the top of my list but I still am tempted to use something sexed to get another heifer on the ground to work with right away....
But then again I don't want gender selected semen to be making my breeding choices for me. you could ask yourself the question, woulld I want 5 Encores x LuLus or do I want 10 Dundees x Lulu. (in ascenerio of using Dundee sexed vs. Encore normal)
Maybe Triday could way in his opinion or even Mayjay as I seem to like the mating they have in their hutches. of course i could probably guess Mr. Mayjays response right now....Charisma.
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16/5/2008, 10:11
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Smurf4
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Stormatic from LuLu family
What about one of the Allen sons to add strenght snd %!
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16/5/2008, 15:07
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I didn't mean to sound like I expected to get those results from a flush. I should have explained it like this do i want a 90% chance of a Dundee heifer or a 50% chance of a encore heifer. Would getting a Encore from this mating be with the increased risk of getting a worthless bull? Flushing with sexed semen seems like a bit of a risk, especialy if I am not sure how the heifer responds. I usually use 4-5 straws of semen when I flush just to make sure I am not missing anything. The semen is usually the lowest cost highest reward part of the whole flush.
I guess my comment you quoted was more about what semen to use on myheifers in general. I am currently breeding them to Damion but am getting some sexed sam when the Damion is out. But would I rather have 1/2 as amny heifer calves and they be all Damions or twice as many heifer clves but them all be MR. Sam? But that topic is for another thread.
But no I am not counting any eggs yet. I have had the luck of getting planty of embryos from flushes but not so good luck getting heifer calves from those eggs. Whether the eggs are frozen or the eggs didn't take or I got a bull calf.
Sometimes it is easy for me to get excited and put the cart infront of the horse and think of all the ways i can make $$ and end up having high expectations ...which leads to getting dissappointed...which leads to discouragement....which leads to complacency. I would like to be a bit more even keel and be patient with this heifer. Which probably means holding off on a flush till after she has calved in and milking and scored. See if I really want to flush her and what I want to flush her too.
I am not sure sure Allen sons have the reliability I would be looking for. Bolivia looks good now but I would have a lot of Inspiration on both sides of the pedigree with all the storm blood and the heifer from LuLu. Another older bull I thought about that made some pretty strong cows, Stardust.
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17/5/2008, 11:04
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I am in the Champlain Valley of Vermont. Dr. Mark Hendrickson has done most of my flushing with real good results as far as embryo recovery. But most of the time I don't have enough recipts available (since my hiefers are boarded off the farm) to implant all the eggs so I end up freezing them. Encore seems like a pretty popular choice thus far.
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17/5/2008, 16:41
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
oh yeah...my goals are to build a herd that is marketable.
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18/5/2008, 0:50
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synergy1
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Stormatic from LuLu family
Congrats on your purchase. Sound like a good one.
Linjet or Allen
Jerland Denison is what Semex is pushing here as the top Allen son(Allen X Jolt)
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19/5/2008, 0:15
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I like Bolivia early proof. But he is still pretty low in reliability. I was shying away from him because he is a Allen x Storm. With the heifer being a Stormatic from Inspirations family I didn't want to have top much more Inspiration in the pedigree.
Denison pedigree looked interesting to me too with both Allen and Jolt in the pedigree but I haven't heard a lot about him or his cow family. Although after checking out Jerland's website i see they even dabble in raisiing some nice german shephards.
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19/5/2008, 1:03
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Will Richardson
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Re: Stormatic from LuLu family
Karona Bonanza looks like a close fit for your cow
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19/5/2008, 21:53
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triday1
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Stormatic from LuLu family
sheik lulu's two best daughters were both linebred tararidge tt lulu EX 95was her triple threat daughter so triple threat times sheik times triple threat. She had an excellent inspiration sister also so inspiration times sheik times triple threat (the dam of inspiration). I would stick with something powerful and probaly not double up the storm especially with a loose uddered bull like mandel in there. Encore times stormatic seems to be magic when the stormatic is out of the encore, so give it a whirl the other way, or dundee, adolph or some other encore son. Stardust nicked well with inpiration blood.
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20/5/2008, 2:45
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triday1
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Stormatic from LuLu family
smous I normally agree with you, but I will take the exception on this one, stardust is one of the very few(of the bulls that people defend for low first lactation yield) that actually mature into extremely productive cows and make really good old cows, unfortunately his sons didn't seem to transmit that as they tend to peak in milk in 1st lactation(not that high) and looks wise about the same time(think how many nice redmarkers make crippled old lazy cows).
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20/5/2008, 13:58
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Jeash
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Re: Stormatic from LuLu family
Our county holds a DHIA banquet every spring. A year or two ago the five highest producing cows were Stardusts. I believe all five were in the 45,000 pound range, and all five were in different herds.
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20/5/2008, 16:14
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foxleigh
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I forgot about him but yes would work......and what do encore,raider and stardust have in common.......
all have sTarbuck in the pedigree
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20/5/2008, 21:31
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Buze77
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Stormatic from LuLu family
I mentioned Stardust because I think he traces back in some popular pedigrees in the breed right now. Windy Know View Peggy and Earnest Anthony SD Tobi both seem to be pretty solid brood cows with impressive progeny. Thanks for the input so far but if i may pick your brains a bit more what are your thoughts on Arnell Elegant on this pedigree? His name has been tossed around on other threads with some popular reviews. He has enticing health traits, high PL, and is a red carrier. Seeing how the Stormatic's pedigree goes back to a Triple Threat is this a worthy risk or a shot in the dark?
Encore and Stardust are my top choices so far. I have some Encore in my tank but what is Stardust selling for these days?
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20/5/2008, 23:18
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