jonnykelso
EX91
Local user
Registered: 07-2003
Location: Dungannon, Co.Tyrone, N.I.
Posts: 201
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
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Stars of the November proofs?!
Hi all, whats your opinions of who the stars of the November proofs are?J
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12/11/2003, 16:49
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Will Richardson
Cowtalk Staff
Global user
Registered: 06-2003
Location: Close to a pub
Posts: 1258
Karma: 14 (+14/-0)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
http://www.holstein-uki.org/Weblive/AnimalData/ASMalefs.asp?AnimalID=20090484
If this is the bull then I cant see the great excitement over him ..... poor components and a very low foot angle.
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29/11/2003, 19:05
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Bob
Local user
Registered: 06-2003
Location: Shropshire / Welsh Border
Posts: 145
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
No Smous, Marshall and Ito don't qualify for EU.
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29/11/2003, 21:18
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Mr America
Global user
Registered: 09-2003
Location: Down Town Bronx New York
Posts: 46
Karma: -1 (+0/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
Isnt BW Marshall dead?? 
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1/12/2003, 1:54
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aph
VG86
Global user
Registered: 06-2003
Location: Ballymoney, Co Antrim
Posts: 86
Karma: 1 (+1/-0)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
the bull is dead
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1/12/2003, 13:09
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canuk
Ex97
True Scarlet
Global user
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 1307
Karma: 23 (+24/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
Broa, I'm a little confused, you were on a run about how we should learn from are mistakes, and how plain or ugly cows are more profitable than pretty ones, now you talk of Lancelot making show cows. Hold on I'm not confused anymore.
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9/12/2003, 17:55
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canuk
Ex97
True Scarlet
Global user
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 1307
Karma: 23 (+24/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
Broa, Sorry its North American genetics thats the problem, and Lancelot has none in his pedigree????????????????
Will - looked at Moet Melodys progeny, and I'm sorry but I can not seem to get excited, all I see is a bunch of average, and a lot of below average scores know we wouldn't agree on probably any sires, but do you honestly beleive if Moet Melody was breed to the same cows as Astronomical, Or Kite, he would come up with a plus proof for conformation?
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9/12/2003, 22:28
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Big Bird
Cowtalk Staff
Global user
Registered: 06-2003
Posts: 2762
Karma: 33 (+33/-0)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
OK, I'll try.
In the art or science thread you start by knocking north american genetics, then you say you are using them, now you are placing a bull from that type of breeding as a star on this topic.
You have also argued in favour of more functional type cows against show type cows, then you are saying lancelot, a bull you are using, will breed show winners. If you don't want that sort of cow why use a bull to produce them?
---
65 cows - 9500 litres @ 3.8 fat, 3.25 protein. 25 VG, 4 EX
Also rear surplus dairy heifers + beef stores.
Simple system, grass based, no TMR. No full time labour.
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10/12/2003, 14:30
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canuk
Ex97
True Scarlet
Global user
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 1307
Karma: 23 (+24/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
Thanks Big Bird, as for your comment on being a teenager, well Broa been milking cows for 25 years, self taught on breeding and genetics and still learning LOTS.Thought I was being nice when I told you to get a camera for your maternity pen. What I really wanted to say was, don't blame North American genetics, for your own poor management. Did oridgeonally think your posts were interesting, now find you hard to take serious.
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10/12/2003, 15:55
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broa
EX97
Isangoma
Global user
Registered: 12-2003
Location: Martebo
Posts: 2299
Karma: 52 (+53/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
canuk,
you say the increase in still births are because of my poor management,
well as I explained in that other thread, nothing other than the level of inbreeding , has changed over the last 25 years. so it's been the same poor management all the way. It also closely follow the numbers for both denmark and sweden, in both countries we've seen a increase of still births of the magnitude I mentioned in that other thread.
If I say something that you don't understand, please feel free to ask.
making sarcastic remarks won't get you anywhere.
Big Bird,
In the art or sience thread I simply stated that I have been using north american genetics for the last 20 years and that I think that because of the increased level of inbreeding I have seen in my herd, partly due to the narrow genetic base in the holstein breed and partly due to my own casual attitude towards the problem of inbreeding, I have seen some less than desireable effects.
I never said anything about giving up on holstein.
as a black and white breeder there's not a whole lot left to choose from, the way I see it.
I also have expressed my opinion that I don't think we make the best possible use of the positive genes in the breed.
In this thread the question was which bull we thought would be the november star,
I chose to mention Lancelot because I think he is probably the most complete bull at the moment. If you look at his proof he will look like just another production bull but there's more to him than that.
I think the problem here might be that some of you guys have been reading more in to my posts then there was, plus being a little touchy about the holstein cow.
Last edited by broa, 10/12/2003, 17:21
---
"It's nothing personal, it's just cowtalk"
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10/12/2003, 16:38
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canuk
Ex97
True Scarlet
Global user
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 1307
Karma: 23 (+24/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
Broa- Seems your too smart for me, and I apoligize for my missunderstanding of the term immature, in Canada that would be considered an insult. I will not be asking you any more questions, as I am no longer interested in your little game.
This post is Stars of Nov proofs- mine is September Storm.
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10/12/2003, 22:48
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canuk
Ex97
True Scarlet
Global user
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 1307
Karma: 23 (+24/-1)
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Re: Stars of the November proofs?!
I am not familiar with this Lancelot bull whatsoever, all I know about him is what I've read on this forum. If inbreeding is a problem use something thats outcross. Just because an outcross may not be popular, if you don't care what a cow looks like so long as she milks, gets pregnent, and lasts, use something else, there are as many different bloodlines, as you choose to find. From what I've reading in lots of mags crossbreeding is getting more and more popular all the time, and most of the smart so called type breeders are very aware of this.
AC1 what is a type breeder? Someone who does not want his cows to milk?? Most of the people I know, are what I would consider commercial, breeders just looking to breed some cows that will last, and I am not aware, of anyone loseing 10% of their calves.
Also when people use words like immature, and get your head out of your ar....es, it keeps others from exspessing their opinions, and this is not a good thing.
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11/12/2003, 3:03
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