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JeffNYRC
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For those considering Talent
He does have several "signature" traits. The rump, and F&L, along with body depth. Unlike other bulls that dont have the consistency. Talent does. The bull calf that was born last August (sent him off in October) had a similar style rump as the other talents born so far this year. The first one this year, nice square rump, straight legs, deep body. The 2nd that is the red talent heifer, same rump. The latest, same style rump, deep body. Two of them were rubens, but the other two, totally different styles of cows, with the same type of calf, well put together.
The calves do come out fairly big, big heads, wide chests. He is every bit worth the 55 or so a unit.
Now to see if the advents are as consistent.
Jeff
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"You can't lose if you don't expect to win." - My show philosophy.
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7/9/2007, 3:27
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JEB12
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Jeff, I love my Talents but from what I have seen he is not a bull I would use to improve feet and legs and he really needs to be protected for chest width.
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7/9/2007, 17:00
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JoePa Giggalos
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Re: …
I agree 100% with JEB. Our Talents tend to be a little course at the hocks, as far as width of chest our Talents X Red Maker are much wider than our Talents X Outside.
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7/9/2007, 17:43
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errolston
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For those considering Talent
Talent, one word...disappointing.
So far we have calved 4 and none of them are particularly good heifers. Some of them milk ok, some dont, and the udders have not been anywhere near as good as expected. I hope they improve here because we have a lot more to calve in the next couple of years.
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8/9/2007, 9:45
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svennis
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Re: For those considering Talent
We are milking three Talents and are very satisfied! Two have been classified. Both went VG-86. One is an average milker, one hasn`t had a milk recording yet and the third is producing 43 kg per day which is well above our herd average for heifers. Udders are a considerable improvement on their dams, rumps have a nice slope and one is a bit coarse in her bone. Apart from that feet&legs are nice. The trait I would protect them most for is chest width!
Surprisingly two have a low milking speed, but this is probably effected through their maternal line. No mastitis problems so far, but fingers crossed.
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9/9/2007, 11:13
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Mooramba
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Re: For those considering Talent
Talent must be something special. I have yet to hear a rep from any opposition company run him down. Usually they have some remarks to make about the high selling bulls, but they just say 'yes he's a good bull ' and move on.
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21/9/2007, 4:58
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IndiesViewGD
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Re: For those considering Talent
The Talents are pees in a pod from what I've seen; wide rumps, deep bodies, good feet and legs, and awesome udders. From what I've noticed and what no one else has mentioned so far is that they need to be protected for heighth at the front end. I feel this is easily his biggest flaw.
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26/9/2007, 2:25
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igen7
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For those considering Talent
i can not say i am really pleased with our talent daughters ofcourse he may be a great bull but i suppose we are guilty of thinking too much of the top sires in the end it is just a percentage game the great ones will have more good ones BUT they will also breed the poor ones as well so we should not be so shocked when they do
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26/9/2007, 8:59
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Gidion
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Re: For those considering Talent
Height in the front is made by long legs and/or deep/big chest. Talents is a Dairy/Smooth bull aAa 156 243. Many Talents I see lack some Tall (long front leg) and Strong (deep chest).
The best Talents have mothers who bring the Tall and Strong into the mating.
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26/9/2007, 18:47
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Buze77
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For those considering Talent
been calving in a bunch of heifers to Talent this fall. Hiefer calves come out easy bull calves seem to be pretty large with big heads and hips. With more to calve in I am praying for hiefers as I may be wearing out my calf puller with any more bulls.
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16/10/2007, 16:51
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BROWNIE 88
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Re: For those considering Talent
Every Talent i've ever seen has tried to kill me, they would have to be some of the worst temperament heifers I've ever seen, just complete nutcases.
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17/10/2007, 10:45
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svennis
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Re: For those considering Talent
Just wondering how satisfied everyone is with the udder health of their Talent daughters. We are only milking one in her first lactation, one in her second lactation and sold one via auction. Until now none of them had any SCC problems, but fingers crossed.
I`m curious, because according to Talents breeding values his daughters seem to perform very differently in distinct countries:
udder health positive:
Sweden (117)
near neutral:
Germany (101)
Netherlands (100)
Italy (98)
France (0.2)
a bit negative:
Australia (8%)
UK (+7)
USA (3.09)
Denmark (92)
clearly negative:
Canada (3.19)
Spain (83)
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22/1/2008, 12:09
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JTTH
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Re: For those considering Talent
quote:
svennis wrote:
Just wondering how satisfied everyone is with the udder health of their Talent daughters. We are only milking one in her first lactation, one in her second lactation and sold one via auction. Until now none of them had any SCC problems, but fingers crossed.
I`m curious, because according to Talents breeding values his daughters seem to perform very differently in distinct countries:
udder health positive:
Sweden (117)
near neutral:
Germany (101)
Netherlands (100)
Italy (98)
France (0.2)
a bit negative:
Australia (8%)
UK (+7)
USA (3.09)
Denmark (92)
clearly negative:
Canada (3.19)
Spain (83)
He's 117 in Denmark too, Sweden and Denmark has the same index NAV. Based on daughters in Sweden,Denmark and Finland
The 92 was he's converted INTERBULL index in august 2007 today january 2008 he's 96
Last edited by JTTH, 22/1/2008, 16:01
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22/1/2008, 15:47
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svennis
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Re: For those considering Talent
Thanks for the info JTTH! That is what I supposed too, but when I looked up his proof on the Danish and on the Swedish website of Viking Genetics I surpisingly found two different proofs:
Swedish proof
Danish proof
I just realised that the Danish website hasn`t been updated yet, but how could he move up from 92 to 117 in six months?
Another thing is that the Swedish proof is only a national one and the Danish is Interbull, but I still wonder why there is such a big difference, because I thought that information from national daughters has much more weight in an Interbull proof as international daughters.
Hmm, as I don`t really understand Scandinavian languages I might have got something else wrong. Sorry for that!
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22/1/2008, 16:10
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svennis
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Re: For those considering Talent
Ok, thanks for clearing this up!
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22/1/2008, 16:11
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JTTH
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Re: For those considering Talent
quote:
svennis wrote:
Thanks for the info JTTH! That is what I supposed too, but when I looked up his proof on the Danish and on the Swedish website of Viking Genetics I surpisingly found two different proofs:
Swedish proof
Danish proof
I just realised that the Danish website hasn`t been updated yet, but how could he move up from 92 to 117 in six months?
Another thing is that the Swedish proof is only a national one and the Danish is Interbull, but I still wonder why there is such a big difference, because I thought that information from national daughters has much more weight in an Interbull proof as international daughters.
Hmm, as I don`t really understand Scandinavian languages I might have got something else wrong. Sorry for that!
OK, i'm trying again, he's converted interbull proof moved up from 92 to 96.
He's national(Scandenavien) index is 117
Take a look at he's fertility index :
converted interbull proof 86
He's (NAV)scandenavien fertility proof 112
The same goes for total index in Denmark
based on interbull figures 109
based on daughters in NAV 123
SORRY but I need to
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22/1/2008, 17:07
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svennis
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Re: For those considering Talent
Thanks, but you didn`t had to try it again. I wrote my post while you were editing your one. I think its all clear now.
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23/1/2008, 10:10
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JTTH
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Re: For those considering Talent
The wasent for you, but for those big differences in indexes.
One of the reasons why I don't belive in breeding programs, who base most of the decissions on thes.
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23/1/2008, 10:47
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Buze77
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For those considering Talent
I used about 40 units of Talent on my hiefers the past 2 years. His conception has been as advertised as he settled most of the heifers on first service. The calves I have had so far are real nice. Black, wide rumps, deep, with good F&L. My only beef so far with this bull is that the calves are big and most of them have been bulls. Now maybe it is just my luck but he has created quite a bit of extra work for me pulling calves and dealing with hiefers that need extra TLC cause they are worn out after pushing 100+lb claves out. The last three hiefers to calve to Talent...
Dundee - big bull, pinched nerve, coming along nicely after 1 week.
Primetime - 120lb hiefer calf, struggled to get up the first couple days now doing alright.
Rudy - just calved in tonight, spent an hour getting a monster bull out. Once I got the head and shoulders out I thought I was home free. The calves hips were so wide spent 45 minutes trying to rotate them out. The heifer was alert and licking the claf when I left the boxstall but only attempted to stand half way up before laying back down. hoping that she will have enough strength to get up in the morning.
Overall I am very pleased with the heifer calves. I even have gotten a few red ones, but I doubt I will use him on heifers again due to the struggles I have had with some of the calves, especially the bulls.
I think he will make some real nice cows (especially judging by his 75% GP or better) but the nicest ones I have come from my cows who have plenty width in between their front shoulders.
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30/1/2008, 3:46
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JeffNYRC
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Re: For those considering Talent
The Talents I have had, haven't been overly big. The first one that I calved in, was a first calf heifer, she had a bull. She had no trouble at all, calved him out in short order without help. The 2nd one I calved to Talent was a red rubens, she didn't have any trouble, that too was a bull. The red talent I have out of a 86pt Rubens (B&W rubens), never stressed her at all. Calf was average size, and she atm is very fancy. Nice straight back, good F&L, chest width isn't narrow at all, not as wide as her first calf, but ideal. The 4th to calve out to Talent here, was a bull calf, no problems, didn't have to assist. He at first was a crumby looking calf, had a rump just like his mother. However after 3 months, his rump changed quite a bit. Sent him off on Tuesday, and that rump on him looked nothing like his mother, looked good considering.
The last one to calve to Talent so far, was an Outside out of a 87pt Progress (Outside should go VG in April). Nice calf, still too young to judge on the legs, however they look good from the side.. Actually her last calf was a Roylane Karat, and that heifer has surprised me (looks pretty good). We'll see how she comes along in the next couple of months.
What I have noticed with these Talents, except for the red talent I have, as they mature through the first couple of months, the rumps get better and better. The F&L seem to depend on how good the dams are. However that Red Talent we have has F&L nothing like the dam (big improvement). Actually same goes with her past calf (Boosside ruben). Her F&L could be from enviornment too (living on concrete till we bought her).
Now the question remains, how will she look when I calve her in June of 09...
Talent is for sure a bull that can settle most anything. I use him if I have troubles with other bulls, and I dont think I have ever had to repeat.. IMO a Good bull..
Jeff
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"You can't lose if you don't expect to win." - My show philosophy.
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30/1/2008, 4:22
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triday1
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For those considering Talent
funny how things differ place to place... talent was crap fertility here... and the oldest daughter ruined my 100% conception rate on sexed semen (9/10). She is fresh and her udder looks to be really nice with really nice legs and a flat wide rump. As we move forward we get to the front end and it falls apart hard. As far as we can tell she has no crops, her spine joins her shoulder blades about 6 inches below the shoulder blades. I will try to get a photo once I clip the hair off so people can see this, I wonder if this is the deformity mentioned on the holstein canada site. ironically her sister by adolph has a beautiful front end structure, so who knows.
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30/1/2008, 16:42
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Mayjay
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Re: For those considering Talent
Many Talents are round in the shoulder, not the type of chine that shows well. The best part is between their legs. For that alone I like em, they can be juicy there too.
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11/2/2008, 6:27
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Mooramba
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Re: For those considering Talent
Semex has just put his price up $10 to $45 here in aus. He must do something right to still have such demand. We only have 2 in milk with 6 to calve this year.
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11/2/2008, 8:15
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noname25
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Re: For those considering Talent
We've just calved in 2. One from a Mtoto and the other from a Stormatic. Both have impressive rear udders and overall are doing well.
In our opinion they make better milkers than heifers as having an udder between their legs helps! We found as maidens/bullers they were a little "hockey" and maybe leave a little to be disired with bone quality.
Temperment seems to be wayyy above average too. Wonderful tempered.
We just ordered another 15 straws for use on heifers.
Loford Holsteins
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11/2/2008, 14:16
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Grasshill
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…
Noname25:
Funny how it goes. I like our Talents but they are crazy, wild, hare-brained..
The two milkers have calmed down after calving (2nd calf) but we have more calves on the ground and they are wild and snaky. If you try to touch them they make that loud 'brawling' noise and try to jump the fence. Or run through you. A toss of the coin, really.
They milk well and look good doing it. They're fine in the freestalls or in the barnyard ... just don't seem to like people at all.
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11/2/2008, 16:43
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flair6
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Re: For those considering Talent
What are people putting there Talents incalf to?
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27/4/2008, 17:39
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foxleigh
Ex97
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For those considering Talent
the word on the street is while they have nice udders they have issues with temprement in the dairy as well as front end problems
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2/5/2008, 4:46
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