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Doctor Delia
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
I've seen "Priscilla...." too and I thought that Hugo was very good in drag, almost too good. But then I read that he has a fondness for drag going back to his school days where he was voted best drag performer. I think he played Gertrude in "Hamlet."
His body build is really more wirey than muscular and he has relatively small upper arms, so I guess that makes it easier for him to portray a woman. Notice how narrow V's shoulders are and how his arms do not really fill out the upper sleeve of his jacket when Weaving is in the V-suit.
And when you get down too it, V is kind of a drag performer. He wears an elaborate wasp-waist costume. A wig. A face mask with rouged cheeks and a touch of lipstick.
The whole get-up looks a little uncomfortable, but it takes a certain discipline to pull it off.
If you look at Weaving's films long enough you notice that he acts with his whole body. Always. And that's another asset in playing V.
Have you noticed how still V's hands are in the scene where V and Evey are watching "The Count of Monte Cristo?" That's got to be stuntman David Leitch behind the mask. Weaving would never stay that still.
Even when he's supposed to be relatively still, as in the scene where V greets Evey in the Shadow Gallery for the first time, Weaving's hands are continually, subtly moving.
That kitchen scene is the best, though (IMHO.) The way Weaving strikes a pose with that plate of EItB always cracks me up. If he had tied that towel around his head he would look like Aunt Jemima.
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10/8/2006, 5:16 pm
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Valkyrie2
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
quote:
His body build is really more wirey than muscular and he has relatively small upper arms, so I guess that makes it easier for him to portray a woman. Notice how narrow V's shoulders are and how his arms do not really fill out the upper sleeve of his jacket when Weaving is in the V-suit.
Well, he's not a bodybuilder, certainly, and there's nothing wrong with that. But he has a really lovely...ok, I'm NOT making a pun here, I DID used to bodybuild, and the term I'm about to use IS the actual term...he has a really nice V-taper. The proportions are good. That's why he does look so good in the doublet.
(If y'all aren't familiar with the term "V-taper," it pertains to the male torso, which, from shoulders to at least waist, some say groin, should resemble a smooth, elongated V shape. Proportionally broad in the shoulder and correspondingly narrow in the waist and hips. Note I said proportionally; it isn't the actual dimensions, but how they fit together, that counts. You can have a good V-taper without having to have deltoids the size of cannonballs. This is also one of the characteristics that makes certain male bodies immediately jump out as very sexy and attractive.)
Weaving is quite tall (6'2" if memory serves) and has that long, lanky build that often goes with it. But from what I've seen, he still has quite a nice thick chest, etc. I'm not gonna complain about looking at him, certainly.  Although a girlfriend of mine and I often commiserate (having seen Priscilla) that it isn't fair that he should have legs that good, when we work so hard on ours... 
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I sense a photo manip challenge...(though do you think this might be too insensitive and offensive?)
I could see it being ok as long as one was careful to avoid what used to be called a "mammy" stereotype. (I'm from the South, mind, so am sensitive to such. If you wanna run it by me off-board before posting it, I'll be glad to offer my thoughts.) Actually one of peahopeless' fanfics had V spring-cleaning the Shadow Gallery with the wig covered by a bandanna, and the image was hilariously funny. He staunchly protested to Evey's giggles through the whole thing, that it was a perfectly practical getup... 
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Have you noticed how still V's hands are in the scene where V and Evey are watching "The Count of Monte Cristo?" That's got to be stuntman David Leitch behind the mask. Weaving would never stay that still.
I agree, and I disagree. There's no reason for it to be Leitch there; there are no stunts in the shot. For this reason, it has to be Hugo. (That's kind of the way movies work; if there's no stunts, it ain't a stuntman. Generally this is because of contracts/agreements/guilds that require it so.)
Granted, Hugo's hands are often very expressive (I know the feeling -- tie my hands up and I can't talk!). But he's quite capable of being very very still when the occasion calls. Go back and have a look at his portrayal of Agent Smith and you'll see what I mean. Sometimes it's his very stillness that is so unnerving, so alien and machinelike, in that characterization.
--- Courage is doing what you’re afraid to do. There can be no courage unless you’re scared.
- Cpt Rickenbacker
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10/8/2006, 8:05 pm
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Vienna7
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
quote:
Valkyrie2 wrote:
Well, he's not a bodybuilder, certainly, and there's nothing wrong with that. But he has a really lovely...ok, I'm NOT making a pun here, I DID used to bodybuild, and the term I'm about to use IS the actual term...he has a really nice V-taper. The proportions are good. That's why he does look so good in the doublet.
Stop it, Valk! 
You know on first appearance, Hugo's now too attractive (at least from my POV), but there's just something about him that drives me crazy!!!
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Weaving is quite tall (6'2" if memory serves) and has that long, lanky build that often goes with it. But from what I've seen, he still has quite a nice thick chest, etc.
Stop it, Valk!
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I could see it being ok as long as one was careful to avoid what used to be called a "mammy" stereotype.
Aunt Jemima IS a mammy stereotype, hence my hesitancy on creating a photo manip!
quote:
Granted, Hugo's hands are often very expressive (I know the feeling -- tie my hands up and I can't talk!). But he's quite capable of being very very still when the occasion calls.
Wasn't he pretty still also when playing Elrond?
---
In honor of KaTie
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beauty is just the beginning of a terror we can only just barely endure,
and we admire it so because it calmly disdains to destroy us.
Every angel is terrible. (Rilke's elegy)
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10/8/2006, 9:11 pm
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Valkyrie2
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
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Stop it, Valk!
Why, whatever is the matter, my dear Vienna??
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Stop it, Valk!
Sorry. I've just been a student of body language, shape, and posture for many years. Y'all tease me about being able to recognize which of the actors/stunt doubles is behind the mask at any given time, but that's why. Given the nature of the job I had for 20 years and just left, being able to "read" people's body language rapidly became a necessity to navigate the minefield of government politics. The "shape and posture" part comes from many years of bodybuilding.
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You know on first appearance, Hugo's now too attractive (at least from my POV),
Now that is where we will have to agree to disagree. I think he's quite nice to look at.
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Aunt Jemima IS a mammy stereotype, hence my hesitancy on creating a photo manip!
I know. What I am saying (and why I suggested the fanfic) is to take the stereotype and go off in a NON-stereotype direction with it.
Seriously, read peahopeless' fanfic. I think it was "You Broke The Bed" or something like that. It's quite funny. They're giving the Shadow Gallery a good spring cleaning. I'm sure you can have wonderful fun with the imagery. Peahopeless's site
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Wasn't he pretty still also when playing Elrond?
Good point. He was. It was subtler there, though.
Depending on role and situation, sometimes restraint in action or outright NON-action is called for, and he's too good an actor not to be aware of that, or to be able to call upon it when need arises.
--- Courage is doing what you’re afraid to do. There can be no courage unless you’re scared.
- Cpt Rickenbacker
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10/8/2006, 9:56 pm
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Venturous
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
quote:
quote:
quote:
Have you noticed how still V's hands are in the scene where V and Evey are watching "The Count of Monte Cristo?" That's got to be stuntman David Leitch behind the mask. Weaving would never stay that still.
...snip...
Granted, Hugo's hands are often very expressive (I know the feeling -- tie my hands up and I can't talk!). But he's quite capable of being very very still when the occasion calls.
I always read his stillness in this scene as if he were holding his breath, waiting for Evey to figure out -- I will have to look again (darn!) to see if he takes on that stillness as the news story comes on. Remember how he tried to turn off the telly before the news comes on!
---  "There is no certainty, only opportunity." -- V
Venturous on IJ
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10/9/2006, 11:29 am
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Doctor Delia
VEEK
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
To all the above: I still think that's not Hugo in the couch scene, although I originally thought it was. The more I look at it, the more I become convinced that it is David Leich.
Although Leich is a pretty good double for Hugo, his body proportions are different. He has shorter legs and a straight back. Hugo has a long waist, longer legs, and a "hump." And Hugo has long fingers. The guy on the couch looks like the same guy who's doing the dueling, and he has small hands.
And I think the reason that's Leich, is that to put Hugo into that scene would be kind of jarring. Better for continuity to keep the same guy in costume and have Weaving do the voiceover.
Leitch is also in the V-suit in the domino scene. Why do you need a stunt man to do that?
Actually I think with all these action movies featuring masked super-heroes, the line between stunt double and actor is becoming blurred. In "Spider-Man" sometimes Tobey Mcguire is doing stunts (Spider-Man kiss, for example) and sometimes the stunt guy is acting (hanging from the Roosevelt Island tram scene. The actress in the scene is Kirsten Dunst but Spider-Man is the stunt guy.)
There are many "composite characters" these days.
Is Darth Vader the actor in the costume or is he James Earl Jones? Add CGI into the mix and it really becomes confusing (for example Golum/Smiegel of "LOTR.")
Anyway, as for Aunt Jemima, I 'm just reminded of her (or any other TV food icon) by the theatrical way that Hugo slings that plate of eggy-in-the-basket as he offers Evey breakfast.
Just look at him. Can't you imagine that smiling face on a box of Uncle V's Frozen, Pre-cooked Eggie-in-the-Basket?
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10/9/2006, 3:43 pm
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ButMadNNW
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
quote:
Doctor Delia wrote:
Actually I think with all these action movies featuring masked super-heroes, the line between stunt double and actor is becoming blurred.
It's all V. The rest is details.
That's one of the things I love about the mask - they were able to get away with things they wouldn't have with the face showing (not everyone is as observant as some of the ladies here, especially when the double is "close enough" - now, V in the opening sequence, whom we know is Purefoy, does look odd to me, but other than that, I haven't been able to notice the difference) - and the sum of it all is that it's all V. Unfortunately, the name on the marquee ends up getting all the credit...
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10/9/2006, 4:31 pm
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Vienna7
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
quote:
Venturous wrote:
I always read his stillness in this scene as if he were holding his breath, waiting for Evey to figure out -- I will have to look again (darn!) to see if he takes on that stillness as the news story comes on. Remember how he tried to turn off the telly before the news comes on!
Ven, that's exactly how I viewed the scene. Also, do you know how one gets when someone watches their absolutely fav movie (in this case, COMC)? You kind of are still and sort of holding your breath waiting for how your friend will react to something you hold so dear. I know I felt that way when my friend saw V4V for the first time. It's like you want them to see what you see and you wait with bated breath. This is how I see that scene with V and Evey and then of course, the news breaks the anticipatory tension.
---
In honor of KaTie
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beauty is just the beginning of a terror we can only just barely endure,
and we admire it so because it calmly disdains to destroy us.
Every angel is terrible. (Rilke's elegy)
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10/9/2006, 5:15 pm
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Valkyrie2
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Re: Hugo weaving behind the mask
Doc Delia, I understand what you're saying. BUT I can see exactly why they might use a stunt man for the domino scene just from the standpoint of the length of re-setup if something happened and the domino shots got screwed up. (Dear Lord, NOBODY sneeze...) That in itself could be justification for considering it a stunt. Hence it would fall under the jurisdiction of the stunt double.
(But I still think it's HW walking around the end of the fallen dominoes, for the simple reason that the strides and footfalls too well match similar scenes of HW's feet from a couple of the Matrix movies.)
In the scene at the end of CoMC, there is NO stunt. There is nothing but sitting there emoting. Now I can't say 100% for certain that the rules are the same in Germany as they are here, but I know that here, they would not permit Leitch to do that scene, because there is NO stunt, it is pure acting, and he is considered a stunt double in V4V. It's a matter of guilds and contracts, as I said previously.
(So why does he get the credit as the "V" store robber? Again, it's a stunt. It involves a firearm.)
Now, I can go back and take a close look at the CoMC scene (after all, any excuse will do, lol) and study the body language and movements a bit more closely, but I doubt I will change my mind as a result. I am convinced that Weaving did that scene.
And I also agree with Ven and Vienna that V is so still because he's awaiting a verdict on the movie from Evey.
--- Courage is doing what you’re afraid to do. There can be no courage unless you’re scared.
- Cpt Rickenbacker
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10/9/2006, 6:31 pm
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I never really thought of it that way, but it is sort of true. My gods, woman you have really analyzed the movie (V4V, not Priscilla) and sliced and diced it!
I sense a photo manip challenge...(though do you think this might be too insensitive and offensive?)