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redheadelizabeth
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Interesting legal tactic
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31174371/
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6/9/2009, 2:32 pm
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lettuceman
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
An interesting story. I thought nudists didn't wear clothes. Does this mean if I wear socks I'm dressed? I do as much work as possible just wearing my sandals and yes, I consider myself to be a nudist.
P.S. I hope the people win and make some progress with the law.
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6/9/2009, 5:04 pm
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TBirder
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
Once again, the Puritan ethic raises its head as the moralists get involved in someone's private life.
They're on their own property,aren't flaunting themselves,yet busybodies get involved.
If those folks don't like what they're seeing, they can look the other way.
Just MHO.
John
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6/11/2009, 9:14 am
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newfieguy
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
technically they aren't on their own property, but even renting the property gives them the right to use it. they aren't doing anything illegal. i don't see how the landlord has a case. hopefully they will win.
i wish i had enough free time to complain about something as stupid as this. some people need to get a life and not worry about everything little thing that may offend them.
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6/11/2009, 9:57 am
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pc44
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
I'm going to have to side with the "puritans" on this one.
"Hink said she's not opposed to people being nude in their houses — or even in a fenced-off back yard — but the Pierces' home is on a corner just a couple of blocks from a school.
"There are so many parks around here, and there are lots of kids around," Hink said. "They're on the corner lot right across the street from the community gardens and the Waldorf school. The whole street is lined with kids."
These people are not quietly gardening in the back yard. This is a front yard on a corner. This is the kind of behavior that even in areas that have lienent laws and tolerance can create a drive for tougher laws.
Just because I can legally get away with something, we should always ask ourselves, should I?
Can I legally get away with something is a terrible standard that haunts the country. For example, PA Congressman "King Of Pork" Congressman Jack Murtha may be able to get away with his behavior. In my book, he should be charged with treason for willfully and blatently wasting taxpayer money and hung on the Capitol steps.
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6/11/2009, 11:03 am
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newfieguy
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
i retract my previous statement. thanks pc44, i didn't realize there was more to the story further down the page. i didn't know they were visible from the street. it almost seems like they were pushing the boundaries to see what they could get away with. i understand why some people are uncomfortable with it.
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6/11/2009, 12:10 pm
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Danglin
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
They may be visible from the street, but they are also not, technically, nude. The reason why they have not been arrested is because they are dressed: thongs and pasties.
If it's not illegal, there should be no problem with it.
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6/11/2009, 1:59 pm
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ManaUser
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
Nobody said they should be arrested. But "not illegal=no problem" is not a good standard. I try to treat people better than that, and I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same from others.
Legally they're within their rights, but they are being rather inconsiderate. And it's not that there's anything wrong with (nearly) naked gardening, just that they're not showing much respect for other people.
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6/12/2009, 2:04 am
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pc44
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
"If it's not illegal, there should be no problem with it. "
Here's why you should have a problem with it. Under the current law, this area is more tolerant that many areas of the country. Even on the beachs, many(most) prohibit thongs.
-Voting constituents complain to their local councilman about people gardening in thongs in the front yard.
-The council changes the law making the thongs criminally obscene. Maybe even subject to sex offener lists.
-Are you happy now?
Paul
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6/12/2009, 5:21 am
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Danglin
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Re: Interesting legal tactic
I work as a lobbyist for LGBT equality. As you can imagine, I'm on the front line in a lot of discussions about what is appropriate, what hurts the movement, what furthers the movement, etc. Also, what is illegal, unconstitutional, discriminatory, acceptable to the general public, and on and on. I also wind up drafting, pushing and opposing legislation by direct visits with legislators and their staffs. In a southern state. Consequently, I've think I've got a pretty good feel about just how reactionary, unreasonable, and even asinine elected officials can be.
I am not concerned about pasties and g-string WHERE THEY ARE NOT ILLEGAL for a few reasons.
1) If people don't use their rights, they lose them. So, you can view the folks gardening in skimpy clothing as being advocates for the current status quo in their town.
2) While such behavior may lead to back lash, I refer you to statement one, above, with the addendum: If people won't fight for their rights, they will lose them.
3) What good does it do to have laws that allow pasties and thongs if everyone is too afraid of offending other people to actually exercise those rights? It's like saying you can't use the First Amendment to make offensive speech because you might offend. YEt, that is the whole point of the first amendment.
For technical reasons, I'm not afraid of a backlash outlawing pasties and thongs. Various jurisdictions have tried to find ways of defining what is appropriate attire, and what is obscene. The limits wind up being, you guessed it, pasties and thongs, or really just g-strings. Yes, there are jurisdictions that have more restrictive codes, but most of them are subject to challenge based upon vagueness, or are simply unenforced. I also don't fear such a backlash happening in Boulder, specifically, because, well, it's Boulder!
Lastly, I live in a town, (Austin) in which going topfree is technically legal, but is rarely exercised. Yes, when it is, there is some consternation. But there hasn't been a backlash, yet. In fact, what few efforts have been made to restrict topfreedom have been met with unified opposition. I can only imagine Boulder would be the same.
Now, where pasties and g-strings ARE illegal, I would be more nervous that offensive behavior, more often than not, would slow down change in a positive direction--with one big exception. Change will not come from people quietly acquiesing to oppresive laws. Change only comes from people pushing the status quo, and sometimes civil disobedience. When and where that should happen is best decided on a case by case basis. But where there are people willing to advocate, push, and disobey overly restrictive laws, I commend them for their efforts.
Change does not come without a struggle.
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6/12/2009, 7:47 am
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